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How does disability law truly protect those with invisible conditions like endometriosis? In this episode, we delve into the world of disability rights with Bryce Rafferty, a passionate attorney from the Colorado Cross Disability Coalition (CCDC). With his unique perspective as both an advocate and legal expert, Bryce reveals the challenges and triumphs of navigating the legal system for people with disabilities. From his journey as a volunteer to a lawyer, he shares how the CCDC fights for essential protections, Medicaid eligibility, and resources for those who need them most.
We explore the often-overlooked complexities of defining disabilities under the ADA and the systemic obstacles faced by individuals with chronic, invisible conditions. Learn how attending medical board meetings can drive healthcare reform and the growing impact of algorithms on Medicaid decisions. Bryce provides a powerful call to action on the importance of legal professionals, community support, and the collective fight for disability rights. Tune in for an eye-opening conversation that blends compassion with critical insights—and don’t miss our next episode as we continue this journey toward inclusivity and justice.
Website endobattery.com
Disability Advocacy and Legal Rights
Speaker 1
0:02
Welcome
to
EndoBattery
,
where
I
share
my
journey
with
endometriosis
and
chronic
illness
,
while
learning
and
growing
along
the
way
.
This
podcast
is
not
a
substitute
for
medical
advice
,
but
a
supportive
space
to
provide
community
and
valuable
information
so
you
never
have
to
face
this
journey
alone
.
We
embrace
a
range
of
perspectives
that
may
not
always
align
with
our
own
.
Believing
that
open
dialogue
helps
us
grow
and
gain
new
tools
always
align
with
our
own
.
Believing
that
open
dialogue
helps
us
grow
and
gain
new
tools
.
Join
me
as
I
share
stories
of
strength
,
resilience
and
hope
,
from
personal
experiences
to
expert
insights
.
I'm
your
host
,
alana
,
and
this
is
EndoBattery
charging
our
lives
when
endometriosis
drains
us
.
Welcome
back
to
EndoBattery
.
Grab
your
cup
of
coffee
or
your
cup
of
tea
and
join
me
at
the
table
.
Speaker 1
0:46
Today
I'm
honored
to
introduce
a
guest
who
brings
not
only
deep
expertise
but
a
unique
lived
experience
that
shapes
his
work
and
advocacy
every
day
.
Joining
me
at
the
table
is
Bryce
Rafferty
,
a
staff
attorney
with
the
Colorado
Cross
Disability
Coalition
.
Bryce
is
not
just
an
advocate
.
He's
also
someone
who
knows
firsthand
the
challenges
of
living
with
a
disability
.
His
journey
has
given
him
a
perspective
that
many
in
the
legal
field
don't
have
,
and
it
fuels
his
commitment
to
supporting
those
with
invisible
and
visible
disabilities
alike
,
allowing
him
to
connect
with
and
truly
understand
the
people
that
he
advocates
for
.
He's
someone
who
not
only
speaks
up
for
others
,
but
has
fought
his
own
battles
for
access
and
understanding
.
Today
,
he
brings
both
heart
and
expertise
to
the
table
,
working
tirelessly
to
ensure
that
everyone
has
a
fair
chance
at
a
fulfilling
life
,
regardless
of
the
challenges
they
face
.
Speaker 1
1:41
Please
help
me
in
welcoming
Bryce
Rafferty
to
the
table
.
Thank
you
,
bryce
,
so
much
for
joining
me
today
,
and
I
appreciate
you
taking
the
time
out
of
your
busy
schedule
to
sit
down
with
us
and
talk
about
your
passion
,
which
is
disability
and
law
.
So
thank
you
so
much
for
joining
me
at
the
table
.
I
appreciate
it
.
Speaker 2
1:56
Of
course
.
Speaker 1
1:57
Can
you
tell
us
what
it
is
you
do
with
the
Colorado
Cross
Disability
Coalition
?
What's
your
role
and
what
is
the
Colorado
Cross
Disability
Coalition
?
What's
your
role
and
what
is
the
Colorado
Cross
Disability
Coalition
?
Speaker 2
2:06
The
Colorado
Cross
Disability
Coalition
is
a
statewide
nonprofit
that
is
a
collective
group
effort
at
what
is
called
integrated
advocacy
,
and
by
that
term
I
mean
that
there
are
various
all
disabilities
really
.
That's
the
cross-disability
component
of
it
,
and
integrated
advocacy
is
both
geographical
and
issue-related
.
So
we
have
,
for
instance
,
I'm
involved
with
a
Medicaid
eligibility
and
appeals
team
.
They
meet
every
morning
to
discuss
the
cases
that
they're
working
on
with
people
all
around
the
state
who
are
being
denied
everything
from
effective
services
by
Medicaid
to
durable
medical
equipment
to
Medicaid
coverage
and
eligibility
.
In
the
first
place
,
complex
,
it's
mostly
administrative
law
in
terms
of
how
disability
law
and
the
laws
that
control
disability
are
enforced
and
administered
.
And
what
I
do
is
they
threw
me
kind
of
all
over
the
board
.
So
I
actually
volunteered
with
CCDC
initially
back
10
years
ago
and
that
was
really
what
got
me
started
on
my
legal
journey
,
because
I
was
doing
this
volunteer
advocacy
and
said
,
hey
,
it's
great
to
be
able
to
go
down
to
the
Capitol
and
testify
for
a
bill
or
go
to
a
hearing
and
give
my
input
,
but
I
could
really
make
some
moves
and
some
changes
and
have
a
more
profound
effect
on
other
people's
lives
in
my
own
life
by
going
into
law
.
So
it
really
wasn't
something
that
I
had
planned
on
doing
.
You
know
,
as
a
kid
,
when
I
was
having
arguments
with
my
parents
and
winning
them
,
they
told
me
that
I
should
be
a
lawyer
and
I
said
,
not
a
chance
,
it's
in
hell
.
But
here
we
are
,
and
so
it's
actually
.
But
here
we
are
,
and
so
it's
actually
.
It's
interesting
.
Speaker 2
4:10
You
know
,
the
disability
got
me
into
the
world
of
advocacy
,
which
got
me
into
law
,
which
then
returned
me
to
the
very
advocacy
nonprofit
that
started
it
all
.
So
,
yeah
,
the
Colorado
Cross
Disability
Coalition
does
the
integrated
advocacy
and
it
does
Medicaid
,
it
does
litigation
and
cease
and
desist
and
demand
letters
to
basically
try
to
enforce
the
Americans
with
Disabilities
Act
and
there's
various
titles
of
that
.
We
can
go
through
that
and
there's
other
laws
as
well
.
But
in
a
nutshell
,
ccdc
is
really
an
all-encompassing
organization
that
advocates
for
people
who
need
help
navigating
a
very
complex
system
to
get
the
benefits
and
services
that
they
need
to
be
as
integrated
themselves
as
much
as
possible
within
society
but
also
get
the
needed
services
and
supports
to
do
so
.
So
we
kind
of
step
in
to
help
people
navigate
a
very
complex
system
and
that
takes
on
a
variety
of
different
shapes
and
forms
and
formats
.
Speaker 1
5:14
I
can
only
imagine
how
challenging
that
can
be
.
I
think
for
a
lot
of
us
within
the
endometriosis
community
,
this
is
something
that
we
struggle
with
,
because
this
is
not
often
seen
as
a
disability
for
many
.
But
when
you
are
crippled
in
pain
for
days
,
if
not
all
the
time
,
due
to
this
disease
,
it
is
a
disability
,
but
it's
just
not
recognized
as
that
,
and
so
I
think
the
challenge
therein
lies
that
what
qualifies
something
as
a
disability
?
When
you
are
talking
about
the
ADA
or
anything
like
that
,
what
do
they
quantify
as
a
disability
?
Speaker 2
5:50
Oh
,
you
want
some
legal
jargon
.
The
ADA
defines
disability
as
any
kind
of
condition
,
physical
or
mental
impairment
that
substantially
affects
or
limits
a
major
life
activity
,
and
so
you're
going
to
have
a
lot
of
argument
over
what
does
substantially
limits
mean
?
What's
the
major
life
activity
?
Speaker 1
6:16
Right
.
Speaker 2
6:17
And
there
has
been
,
and
there
will
continue
to
be
,
a
lot
of
litigation
and
argument
about
that
.
There
have
been
actually
recently
.
This
is
one
thing
I'm
working
on
.
I
am
putting
into
plain
English
,
as
best
as
I
possibly
can
,
a
bunch
of
new
rules
and
regulations
that
are
correlated
to
the
Rehabilitation
Act
,
which
is
kind
of
a
sister
act
of
the
Americans
with
Disabilities
Act
,
and
how
these
laws
work
,
at
least
federally
,
and
I
mean
it's
similar
with
states
.
But
I
mean
you
take
Congress
right
,
and
so
Congress
identifies
a
problem
and
in
the
case
of
disability
it's
okay
.
We
have
a
very
large
subset
of
our
population
that
is
not
integrated
into
society
.
They're
not
in
the
workforce
,
they're
not
able
to
have
independent
lives
.
These
are
people
who
are
capable
of
and
want
to
be
in
society
,
but
they're
in
assisted
living
facilities
under
very
difficult
conditions
,
often
having
to
deal
with
neglect
,
abuse
.
So
the
whole
idea
really
and
this
came
out
of
the
culture
revolution
in
the
60s
and
70s
Initially
the
Rehabilitation
Act
was
passed
in
1973
.
Americans
with
Disabilities
Act
,
the
ADA
,
was
1990
.
Speaker 2
7:40
And
then
there's
a
bunch
of
case
law
and
courts
were
passed
that
go
into
great
depth
and
help
in
defying
disability
.
Speaker 2
7:52
They
take
that
definition
that's
in
the
ADA
,
you
know
,
substantially
limiting
major
life
activities
and
what
an
impairment
is
,
and
people
might
have
heard
about
the
Supreme
Court
decision
that
overturned
Chevron
,
and
I
mean
you
might
like
hear
that
phrase
and
have
no
idea
what
it
means
.
Speaker 2
8:10
But
basically
what
it
means
in
practice
is
that
Congress
and
other
administrative
agencies
,
like
the
Department
of
Health
and
Human
Services
,
for
instance
,
in
this
case
have
to
be
extremely
specific
when
they
are
defining
both
who
benefits
from
certain
rules
,
how
they're
supposed
to
work
,
what
context
they
apply
in
,
where
they
don't
.
And
so
these
rules
that
were
just
promulgated
and
went
into
effect
in
July
,
I
believe
,
go
into
great
detail
and
they
add
chronic
fatigue
syndrome
,
they
add
COVID
,
they
add
a
lot
of
invisible
disabilities
,
which
is
great
to
see
because
that
is
a
very
underserved
population
,
to
your
point
.
So
,
generally
speaking
,
the
law
really
defines
disability
in
that
kind
of
big
umbrella
term
of
an
impairment
that
substantially
limits
a
major
life
activity
,
and
we're
getting
a
lot
more
help
from
the
Department
of
Health
and
Human
Services
in
defining
what
all
those
elements
are
and
providing
like
a
ton
of
examples
,
which
is
great
.
Speaker 2
9:13
Yeah
,
because
then
you
can't
argue
that
in
court
,
or
you
can
point
to
an
actual
regulation
and
get
an
answer
.
Speaker 1
9:20
How
does
that
translate
,
though
?
I
mean
,
the
law
goes
into
place
,
but
how
does
that
translate
in
real
life
?
Because
I
feel
like
a
lot
of
us
,
especially
with
the
invisible
chronic
illnesses
that
people
don't
see
on
the
outside
that
are
limiting
our
ability
to
work
,
our
ability
to
do
basic
life
functions
sometimes
,
which
is
grocery
shop
,
clean
your
house
,
sometimes
go
to
the
bathroom
,
all
of
these
things
.
It's
limiting
.
But
because
it
isn't
a
visible
physical
disability
,
we
come
up
against
employers
who
are
saying
you
can't
work
here
or
you
get
you
know
they
fire
you
after
a
certain
amount
of
time
because
you
can't
work
.
But
then
we
also
don't
get
benefits
,
oftentimes
because
it
doesn't
qualify
to
some
people
.
Or
how
do
we
fight
that
?
How
do
we
put
this
into
play
?
I
guess
is
what
I'm
trying
to
say
.
Speaker 2
10:07
Yeah
,
so
complex
question
,
simple
answer
.
If
we
as
a
society
want
to
be
inclusive
,
actually
providing
equal
opportunity
to
people
,
everyone
,
every
group
,
then
we
have
to
provide
the
means
through
which
those
people
can
achieve
those
ends
.
And
you
do
that
by
meeting
them
where
they
are
.
And
you
can't
do
that
unless
you're
willing
to
listen
,
acknowledge
problems
and
petition
your
elected
representatives
to
do
something
about
it
.
Because
I
mean
,
in
the
court
system
,
most
of
the
time
you're
arguing
about
the
words
put
onto
paper
by
people
that
you
elect
to
make
laws
right
.
So
when
it
comes
,
I
mean
,
for
instance
,
for
me
,
I
got
my
law
school
paid
by
a
state
entity
called
the
Division
of
Vocational
Rehabilitation
.
I
applied
,
I
gave
my
counselor
who
,
julie
Ambrosio
shout
out
,
absolute
hero
gave
her
80
pages
of
an
application
of
why
I
should
be
granted
the
money
to
go
to
law
school
,
what
I
plan
to
do
with
it
.
Speaker 2
11:22
you
know
what
the
employment
situation
was
looking
like
in
terms
of
the
field
,
its
growth
the
opportunities
that
would
be
awaiting
me
when
I
graduated
and
that
was
granted
to
me
,
and
they
paid
for
everything
from
the
tuition
to
my
books
,
to
parking
,
to
bar
prep
courses
,
and
I
mean
there's
a
lot
of
supportive
services
that
I
think
are
needed
,
but
there's
also
a
lot
of
understanding
that
needs
to
occur
and
learning
from
employers
,
because
the
positions
themselves
are
not
built
to
be
able
to
be
performed
by
many
people
with
disabilities
,
capabilities
people
don't
understand
.
Like
for
me
as
a
quadriplegic
,
it
takes
me
three
,
three
and
a
half
hours
after
I
wake
up
to
be
ready
for
the
day
.
So
I
need
home
health
care
.
I
need
to
get
all
these
things
done
.
Speaker 2
12:13
I
get
up
,
I
need
to
go
to
the
bath
,
take
a
shower
,
get
dressed
,
get
in
my
chair
,
get
positioned
.
I
mean
.
Then
I
have
an
adaptive
van
that
I
drive
from
.
I
have
to
be
in
a
power
chair
to
be
in
that
.
I
have
to
pack
all
my
things
that
I
need
for
the
whole
day
,
and
then
I
also
have
the
need
of
a
home
health
aid
at
night
.
So
I
have
a
bedtime
.
I'm
35
years
old
,
got
a
bedtime
9
o'clock
,
knock
,
knock
,
okay
,
my
day's
over
,
so
it's
truncated
.
Speaker 1
12:41
Right
.
Speaker 2
12:41
So
if
I'm
going
to
do
40
hours
a
week
plus
,
get
everything
I
need
you
know
,
errands
done
,
doctor's
appointments
done
,
get
into
the
gym
to
make
sure
I'm
like
,
I'm
actually
healthy
,
I'm
having
time
to
eat
.
All
of
that
I
mean
like
realistically
,
no
,
I
may
not
be
able
to
do
40
hours
a
week
.
Right
and
that
immediately
is
going
to
eliminate
me
from
the
pool
of
candidates
for
95%
of
jobs
.
It's
not
that
I
can't
do
the
work
,
it's
just
that
I
need
accommodations
.
Speaker 1
13:16
Right
.
Speaker 2
13:17
Maybe
I
need
to
work
36
hours
,
maybe
20
,
maybe
38
.
Speaker 2
13:21
I
mean
,
you
know
,
and
oh
yeah
,
I'll
need
some
dictation
software
,
but
with
the
right
equipment
,
with
the
right
understanding
,
I
mean
,
can
I
perform
the
job
duties
of
you
know
a
given
legal
position
as
well
,
or
potentially
better
,
than
another
candidate
?
Speaker 2
13:38
Yeah
,
but
instead
of
embracing
the
unknown
and
working
with
people
with
disabilities
and
working
to
understand
the
need
to
actually
put
people
with
disabilities
in
positions
to
succeed
,
I
think
employers
are
just
looking
at
bottom
line
and
they
see
a
person
who
wheels
into
an
interview
or
who
mentions
that
they
have
a
disability
in
the
interview
if
it's
invisible
.
Speaker 2
14:02
I'm
very
passionate
about
this
point
because
if
we
as
a
society
really
want
to
be
inclusive
,
then
we
really
need
to
understand
that
we
need
to
have
people
in
the
workforce
.
We
need
to
provide
them
with
the
means
to
get
educated
,
means
to
get
jobs
,
means
to
have
independent
lifestyles
,
families
,
and
if
we
don't
,
then
we're
going
to
have
a
society
where
people
with
disabilities
they
have
no
incentive
to
be
able
to
get
off
of
Medicaid
or
Medicare
be
able
to
take
the
leap
out
of
their
parents'
homes
if
they're
disabled
when
they're
born
or
before
they're
adults
,
and
or
to
continue
living
if
they're
disabled
once
they're
an
adult
.
I
mean
I
can
stop
and
unpack
a
lot
of
these
different
areas
,
but
really
what
we
need
to
do
is
we
need
to
provide
the
same
opportunities
of
education
and
employment
to
people
,
and
people
with
disabilities
need
to
be
seen
in
society
,
and
to
be
seen
,
you
have
to
be
independent
.
Speaker 2
15:08
And
that
means
you
have
to
have
an
education
and
you
have
to
have
work
,
but
if
we
do
that
,
it's
going
to
have
significantly
less
burden
on
the
budget
as
well
.
Speaker 1
15:17
Yeah
,
absolutely
.
Speaker 2
15:18
So
I
mean
,
it's
really
a
win-win
when
you
think
about
it
,
because
you're
going
to
also
bring
in
all
these
different
perspectives
to
different
lines
of
work
,
everything
from
art
to
law
to
finance
,
and
so
really
it
boils
down
to
if
we're
going
to
have
people
with
disabilities
in
our
society
,
then
we
should
treat
them
the
same
way
that
we
treat
everybody
else
,
and
that
means
taking
some
extra
steps
and
being
willing
to
learn
about
what
those
steps
are
.
Speaker 1
15:47
We
all
.
I
think
there's
that
desire
too
to
be
productive
members
of
society
and
I
think
the
more
that
we
can
accommodate
disability
,
invisible
chronic
illnesses
,
the
more
productive
society
is
as
a
whole
,
because
then
if
you're
not
accommodating
that
,
you're
excluding
some
pretty
potentially
powerful
people
from
accomplishing
great
things
within
society
.
I
know
there
are
some
protections
in
place
for
those
who
have
a
disability
and
who
are
in
need
of
aids
and
stuff
like
that
,
but
invisible
illnesses
often
I
feel
like
we
don't
feel
protected
by
any
of
those
things
.
Speaker 2
16:23
Yeah
,
I
mean
there
are
protections
on
paper
broad
ones
but
what
happens
?
Systemic Barriers in Healthcare Advocacy
Speaker 2
16:29
Take
Colorado
State
Medicaid
.
I
was
just
looking
at
a
whole
400
pages
worth
of
rules
for
case
management
.
There
was
a
glaring
absence
of
specificity
,
definitions
,
even
people
like
supportive
decision
makers
from
these
rules
and
as
an
advocacy
nonprofit
CCDC
myself
and
a
bunch
of
other
people
in
the
advocacy
space
you
can
go
to
these
monthly
medical
service
board
meetings
.
They're
once
a
week
.
You
can
give
public
testimony
to
anybody
.
Medical
service
board
meetings
they're
once
a
week
.
You
can
give
public
testimony
to
anybody
.
Now
is
that
going
to
affect
the
rule
and
the
language
in
there
and
how
it
manifests
in
practice
?
Well
,
it
depends
on
how
many
people
testify
,
I
suppose
I
mean
if
there
is
enough
demand
for
things
to
change
in
our
system
.
Speaker 2
17:20
I
mean
,
change
happens
slowly
,
but
I
mean
,
you
know
,
100
years
ago
women
couldn't
vote
,
I
wouldn't
be
alive
,
you
know
.
Speaker 2
17:29
And
here
we
are
.
So
change
is
possible
,
but
you
really
have
to
advocate
for
it
and
you
have
to
know
where
and
how
to
do
that
.
And
I
think
the
problem
is
that
a
lot
of
these
protections
,
especially
for
people
with
invisible
disabilities
,
are
just
not
well
informed
.
It's
not
the
people
writing
the
rules
have
no
idea
what
they're
doing
,
right
,
they
probably
are
,
you
know
,
influenced
a
lot
by
Wall
Street
.
People
don't
know
this
,
but
Deloitte
,
a
Wall
Street
entity
,
you
know
,
financial
institution
is
about
to
run
Medicaid
for
like
26
states
through
algorithms
,
and
those
algorithms
will
determine
eligibility
,
whether
or
not
you
get
approved
for
a
surgery
,
and
the
test
run
has
been
catastrophic
in
states
like
Tennessee
.
But
these
big
changes
are
happening
.
And
so
,
going
back
to
your
question
,
the
protections
for
people
with
invisible
disabilities
exist
broadly
with
these
big
statutes
and
laws
,
but
they
go
into
play
administratively
and
Congress
and
the
Supreme
Court
really
give
states
a
lot
of
deference
and
you
know
states
are
constitutionally
speaking
in
charge
of
and
they
have
primary
concern
and
responsibility
for
public
health
and
safety
of
their
citizens
.
Speaker 2
18:56
So
that
gets
translated
into
each
state's
unique
Medicaid
and
Medicare
.
Medicare
is
more
uniform
,
but
I
mean
Medicaid
is
different
in
every
state
.
Like
Colorado
is
totally
different
from
,
say
,
like
Iowa
or
North
Dakota
or
Alabama
.
So
that
means
it's
tricky
,
but
it
also
means
that
the
people
in
each
state
have
an
opportunity
through
rulemaking
processes
,
because
there's
notice
of
proposed
rules
,
there's
opportunities
to
give
public
testimony
,
but
there's
also
if
you
are
able
to
get
into
a
group
of
people
and
advocate
,
whether
that
be
through
a
lawsuit
or
just
through
educating
yourself
with
what
the
laws
are
and
what
the
rules
are
and
what
needs
to
be
done
to
improve
the
situation
.
I
think
people
realize
they
have
a
lot
more
power
than
it
may
seem
Interesting
.
Speaker 1
19:55
But
that's
a
big
overview
of
it
.
Maybe
progress
doesn't
happen
as
fast
is
because
it
is
so
convoluted
.
And
when
you're
dealing
with
a
population
who
typically
has
chronic
fatigue
,
chronic
pain
and
brain
fog
,
it
becomes
very
unattainable
to
a
lot
of
people
because
it's
not
accessible
to
them
in
their
ability
to
take
the
time
to
learn
it
.
A
lot
of
times
,
if
they're
not
,
if
it's
not
their
job
,
if
it's
,
you
know
,
it's
very
,
very
hard
to
pick
up
all
of
the
nuances
of
these
laws
and
regulations
.
So
we
just
don't
,
and
it's
because
we're
tired
.
We're
a
tired
population
,
you
know
.
Speaker 1
20:35
And
it's
not
user-friendly
for
those
of
us
in
this
population
who
struggle
to
just
maintain
everyday
life
.
Speaker 2
20:42
to
pick
up
one
more
thing
,
that's
very
convoluted
,
oh
yeah
,
and
that's
the
trick
too
,
because
,
for
instance
,
I
remember
I
was
I've
done
a
couple
of
appeals
for
myself
and
I
mean
I
know
how
to
advocate
for
myself
and
I
don't
have
chronic
fatigue
syndrome
,
although
I
do
have
chronic
pain
.
I
do
have
a
lot
of
other
things
that
get
in
the
way
.
Right
,
but
through
the
appeals
process
,
through
Medicaid
as
an
administration
,
they
do
have
what
they
call
the
Office
of
Administrative
Courts
,
so
I
mean
you
can
write
these
appeals
and
submit
them
,
but
what
I
learned
is
that
after
I
did
one
before
law
school
and
then
in
my
final
year
of
law
school
and
I
got
denied
a
piece
of
durable
medical
equipment
that
I
really
should
have
gotten
us
to
,
court
I
said
well
,
that's
amazing
.
Speaker 2
21:51
You're
telling
me
that
I
am
in
a
population
of
people
who
are
disabled
and
or
without
sufficient
income
so
as
to
qualify
for
Medicaid
.
But
to
advocate
for
myself
and
to
point
out
that
you're
breaking
federal
law
,
I
have
to
somehow
find
money
or
somebody
to
represent
me
in
court
.
How
does
that
make
it
?
It
doesn't
make
any
sense
.
Speaker 1
22:17
No
.
Speaker 2
22:19
And
the
people
who
are
in
the
advocacy
world
are
phenomenal
.
And
there's
this
big
misconception
,
I
think
,
about
lawyers
.
I
just
have
to
give
a
shout
out
to
the
profession
.
There's
a
lot
of
people
out
there
.
Legal
profession
has
gotten
a
lot
of
heat
because
of
politics
,
because
of
some
bad
actors
out
there
who
are
high
profile
,
because
of
some
bad
actors
out
there
who
are
high
profile
.
There's
so
many
people
who
really
care
,
who
really
work
hard
in
government
,
in
nonprofits
,
in
private
practices
,
and
they're
really
working
hard
because
they
give
a
damn
Right
and
we
need
more
people
like
that
.
Speaker 2
22:56
But
people
are
people
Right
,
Whether
they're
disabled
,
whether
they're
white
,
whether
they're
brown
,
whether
they're
living
here
in
Colorado
or
in
Bangladesh
society
.
And
we're
going
to
put
a
little
extra
effort
into
this
cause
and
demand
that
to
be
a
reality
for
the
people
who
can't
do
it
because
they
have
disabilities
that
prevent
them
from
doing
so
themselves
.
So
if
you
really
want
equality
and
you
want
diversity
,
equity
,
inclusion
and
all
that
good
stuff
,
you
can't
just
like
pick
one
subcategory
of
that
.
I
mean
,
you
really
have
to
demand
the
grand
scale
of
it
.
I
mean
it
should
be
a
goal
and
a
process
that
never
really
gets
achieved
because
it's
continually
getting
better
.
Speaker 1
23:56
Right
,
it's
an
effective
ecosystem
.
That's
what
we
want
,
right
?
Yeah
,
it's
the
only
way
to
do
it
.
Speaker 2
24:00
It's
the
only
way
to
do
it
.
You
can't
just
say
,
okay
,
well
,
all
you
people
in
wheelchairs
get
together
and
make
change
.
I
mean
it's
not
realistic
,
right
.
It
ain't
going
to
work
,
right
.
Speaker 1
24:11
Well
,
and
that's
like
putting
all
the
chronic
illness
people
who
do
have
chronic
fatigue
or
chronic
pain
and
saying
you
do
all
the
work
,
Well
,
we
go
and
play
.
It
doesn't
work
that
way
.
Speaker 2
24:21
It's
while
we
go
play
golf
and
have
a
club
sandwich
,
I
mean
it
doesn't
work
that
way
,
no
it
doesn't
,
and
it's
like
,
it's
blunt
,
but
like
I
say
this
to
myself
a
lot
If
you're
going
to
keep
me
alive
,
save
my
life
and
you
know
,
put
some
metal
on
my
neck
and
give
me
a
nice
wheelchair
and
all
that
jazz
and
,
you
know
,
some
,
some
health
insurance
.
Shouldn't
it
be
a
little
more
than
that
?
Or
are
we
as
a
society
okay
with
people
making
money
off
of
my
condition
for
the
rest
of
my
days
,
and
that
being
my
contribution
to
society
,
absent
me
taking
extraordinary
efforts
to
get
really
a
suboptimal
ultimate
reality
?
I
mean
,
like
Medicaid
is
the
only
insurance
that
will
pay
for
home
health
care
that
I
need
every
day
of
the
year
.
Speaker 1
25:13
Interesting
.
Speaker 2
25:14
The
only
one
,
wow
,
and
Colorado
for
only
maybe
10
to
15
years
now
has
had
a
waiver
of
Medicaid
where
I
can
actually
work
and
make
a
decent
amount
of
money
.
But
there's
still
a
ceiling
.
Speaker 1
25:28
Right
.
Speaker 2
25:29
So
because
I'm
more
,
I
get
punished
for
trying
to
be
independent
,
interesting
In
the
sense
that
I'm
only
allowed
to
make
a
certain
amount
of
money
.
Otherwise
,
you
know
,
if
I
make
more
than
X
dollars
a
year
,
then
I
have
to
pay
for
all
of
my
home
health
care
or
get
like
120
days
,
I
think
,
of
coverage
,
and
I'm
pretty
sure
the
insurance
,
would
you
know
,
mandate
that
I
go
with
a
certain
home
health
agency
and
right
now
I'm
on
a
waiver
where
I'm
able
to
hire
and
pick
and
choose
my
own
home
health
aides
and
have
a
phenomenal
team
right
now
.
But
I
mean
,
that's
a
huge
problem
too
.
It's
a
whole
nother
conversation
,
that's
interesting
.
Speaker 1
26:11
We
see
this
even
,
I
think
,
in
the
Indo
community
of
like
.
The
role
that
money
plays
and
the
ability
to
like
get
proper
care
is
so
limited
.
So
,
for
endometriosis
,
because
the
laws
in
place
are
based
off
of
an
outdated
theory
,
many
of
us
will
go
through
surgery
after
surgery
,
after
surgery
after
surgery
,
instead
of
getting
the
proper
surgery
the
first
time
,
and
so
it's
really
frustrating
,
because
we
could
ultimately
save
not
only
the
system
but
many
other
things
,
including
ourselves
,
and
have
a
better
quality
of
life
.
We
could
save
so
much
more
money
overall
.
But
because
money
is
at
play
and
you
talk
about
,
you
know
,
wall
Street
owning
the
Medicare
system
For
us
,
it's
big
pharma
for
a
lot
of
people
because
they
want
to
do
medical
management
as
opposed
to
actually
getting
to
the
root
of
the
issue
,
and
that
poses
a
lot
of
issues
when
it
comes
to
trying
to
access
proper
care
and
treatment
,
because
of
this
outdated
theory
and
because
big
pharma
is
dictating
what
is
proper
care
and
treatment
as
opposed
to
what
is
proven
to
be
proper
care
and
treatment
,
and
so
it
just
is
like
this
mangled
mess
that
is
costing
us
,
the
ones
suffering
the
most
,
money
,
time
,
energy
and
effort
,
and
it
gets
overlooked
by
those
who
are
unaffected
by
this
disease
,
and
so
I
think
that
becomes
more
of
an
issue
because
we
as
a
community
struggle
trying
to
get
accessible
care
without
the
ability
to
work
for
it
,
because
we're
tired
,
we're
really
honestly
,
it
is
such
a
there's
so
much
nerve
involvement
,
there's
so
many
muscular
things
involved
and
breathing
and
whether
you
have
thoracic
endometriosis
or
not
depends
on
whether
you
can
work
.
Speaker 1
27:58
So
we
can't
work
to
get
the
proper
care
and
treatment
,
to
pay
out
of
for
the
correct
providers
,
but
additionally
,
we
can't
even
attain
it
through
the
insurance
companies
because
they
don't
see
it
as
the
proper
care
and
treatment
.
So
it's
kind
of
a
very
that's
a
very
convoluted
way
of
saying
we're
very
much
in
this
damned
if
we
do
,
damned
if
we
don't
situation
for
a
lot
of
us
and
that's
where
I
think
a
lot
of
us
are
like
what
are
our
rights
as
people
with
invisible
illness
?
You
know
,
what
do
we
need
to
do
to
attain
certain
disability
rights
?
Because
we
feel
like
we
don't
qualify
for
either
or
,
and
I
don't
know
the
answer
to
that
.
Speaker 2
28:36
Well
,
that's
an
existential
question
.
I
got
injured
in
a
country
called
Switzerland
.
In
Switzerland
,
healthcare
is
a
right
,
not
a
for-profit
industry
.
In
America
,
when
you
talk
about
big
pharma
,
you
talk
about
the
health
industry
generally
.
It's
a
bottom
line
for-profit
industry
.
If
you
have
a
for-profit
anything
,
the
incentives
are
going
to
be
to
profit
.
Speaker 1
29:00
Right
.
Speaker 2
29:00
And
the
healthcare
context
to
profit
continuously
.
You're
going
to
need
sick
people
Right
,
and
a
disabled
person
is
a
dream
for
a
for-profit
system
because
you
need
continual
care
for
the
rest
of
your
life
.
Cures
are
the
antithesis
.
Right
Preventative
treatments
,
medications
every
day
.
Why
are
Americans
on
medications
every
day
?
Speaker 2
29:22
And
you
go
abroad
and
people
are
like
drinking
tea
,
eating
In
Switzerland
.
It
was
crazy
because
I
mean
,
they're
not
part
of
the
EU
so
they
don't
have
all
the
processed
food
.
But
to
take
it
back
to
disability
and
health
,
so
I
get
injured
in
a
shallow
water
diving
accident
with
someone
.
I'm
20
years
old
and
I
am
five
days
into
a
study
abroad
semester
in
college
and
the
Swiss
gave
me
the
green
light
to
go
to
their
premier
spinal
cord
injury
facility
,
to
SPC
in
Lucerne
.
Now
I
also
went
to
Craig
Hospital
here
in
the
States
and
this
is
not
a
slight
at
all
.
On
Craig
Hospital
,
I
love
Craig
Hospital
and
it's
one
of
the
best
institutions
for
spinal
cord
injuries
and
brain
injuries
in
the
country
.
The
difference
is
at
SPC
in
Switzerland
.
First
of
all
,
the
facility
.
Everything
was
integrated
.
They
had
their
own
ICU
,
their
own
surgical
unit
,
they
had
170
beds
.
They
had
a
ton
of
outpatient
services
as
well
as
inpatient
services
.
Speaker 2
30:23
It
was
also
the
headquarters
for
all
the
Swiss
Paralympians
and
Paralympic
teams
.
It
had
sports
facilities
,
basketball
courts
,
pools
that
were
also
used
by
the
community
.
But
the
plan
of
action
for
a
new
injury
like
myself
was
as
a
quadriplegic
,
you're
there
for
nine
months
.
If
you're
a
paraplegic
,
which
for
the
audience
means
you
know
you
have
generally
full
use
of
your
arms
and
full
dexterity
,
so
I
mean
you
can
kind
of
transfer
yourself
.
You're
in
a
manual
wheelchair
.
I
mean
you
can
kind
of
transfer
yourself
,
you're
in
a
manual
wheelchair
,
your
upper
body
looks
totally
normal
,
but
still
like
six
months
,
nine
months
for
a
quadriplegic
.
I
mean
at
Craig
Hospital
you're
lucky
to
get
three
.
Speaker 2
31:05
Wow
.
Now
here's
the
difference
Nine
months
inpatient
at
that
hospital
,
spz
and
Switzerland
not
only
gives
your
body
enough
time
to
physically
recover
but
it
also
gives
you
enough
time
to
learn
how
to
be
functional
Comprehensive Rehabilitation and Advocacy
Speaker 2
31:20
.
You
know
,
for
instance
,
you
learn
how
to
do
all
the
transfers
that
you're
going
to
need
to
be
able
to
do
,
how
to
take
care
of
yourself
.
They
work
with
you
to
modify
your
home
,
get
that
done
while
you're
in
the
hospital
.
They
work
with
your
employer
to
get
you
the
reasonable
modifications
or
accommodations
that
you
might
need
If
you
have
the
function
to
be
able
to
drive
.
Speaker 2
31:42
They
teach
you
how
to
drive
and
either
put
adaptive
equipment
in
your
existing
vehicle
or
help
you
get
a
vehicle
that
you
can
drive
by
the
time
you
leave
SPZ
,
you
have
done
the
amount
of
work
and
growth
,
or
at
least
planted
the
seeds
for
growth
,
that
you
would
be
lucky
to
achieve
in
five
to
10
years
at
Gregg
Hospital
as
an
outpatient
coming
back
for
yearly
re-evaluations
.
Speaker 1
32:08
Thank
you
for
joining
us
at
the
table
this
week
.
If
you
found
this
episode
inspiring
and
thought-provoking
,
join
us
again
next
week
as
Bryce
continues
to
enlighten
us
on
different
aspects
that
he's
learned
about
,
not
only
law
but
personal
experiences
with
disability
.
Until
next
time
,
continue
advocating
for
you
and
for
those
that
you
love
.